‘Paradise’ Star at Center of Next Big Twist Weighs in on Fan Theories and Fears Raised in Mystery Series

[This story contains major spoilers from the fourth episode of Paradise, “Agent Billy Pace.”]

A quiet flashback scene in this week’s episode of Paradise hinted that there was more to Agent Billy Pace than anyone knew.

Two months into their life in so-called Paradise — the underground community bunker that saved its 25,000 residents from an extinction-level event believed to have ended the world above — Secret Service Agent Xavier Collins (Sterling K. Brown) sat at a bar with his fellow agent, who is played by Jon Beavers.

Xavier’s wife never made it to Paradise, where Xavier is now living with their two children. Seeing life getting back to some normalcy makes Xavier grieve even harder for the life he lost. But Billy says the opposite. He confides that he never sat with a friend at a bar in his previous life, and that if Xavier knew some of the things he had done, he might not be sitting there with him.

Flashing ahead to present day and circling back on that conversation, Billy tells Xavier that he will tell him everything he’s done. With suspicions rising all over Paradise after the murder of the surviving U.S. President, played by James Marsden, Billy wants to come clean to his closest friend. But Billy never makes it to tomorrow.

The final scene in the fourth episode in This Is Us creator Dan Fogelman‘s twisty new political thriller shows Billy being murdered by the last person anyone would have expected. His girlfriend, fellow agent Jane (Nicole Brydon Bloom), as it turns out, is actually a mercenary-for-hire by Sinatra, the billionaire who runs Paradise played by Julianne Nicholson. When Billy fought back against Sinatra, she set his murder in motion.

“What Dan Fogelman did that’s really special is that he asks through Billy, are we more than just the sum of the worst things we’ve ever done?” Beavers tells The Hollywood Reporter in the conversation below about Billy’s shocking and emotional arc. He then zooms out to say, “What makes this show the right-now show is that it’s asking questions we’re all trying not to ask in the back of our heads.”

The “Agent Billy Pace” episode also revealed another huge twist following a twisty three-episode premiere — there is life outside of Paradise. Sinatra had told everyone their communication had been fried, leading the survivors in the bunker to believe there was no viable life above. They even sent scientists out on a rescue mission, but those scientists never returned.

Another flashback revealed Billy’s role in their fate, and just how pinned he was under Sinatra’s thumb. Billy’s backstory showed that he landed in prison for murdering his abusive uncle as a kid and that when he got out, he was pulled into a mercenary training group. Despite his clean slate in Paradise — where he found a relationship with Jane and a family with Xavier and his children — Sinatra used Billy’s past against him; she forced him on a murder mission to assassinate those scientists. Before killing one of them, Billy was told that life above is not what they thought. It’s not a “third-world planet,” as Sinatra had described: “Theres life. The air… you can breathe.”

Now with Billy among the deceased, Beavers talks about the secrets that may die with him and if we’ve really seen the last of him in Paradise. He says both twists and answers lie ahead in the murder-mystery series that feels alarmingly timely as it tackles climate change and power, while promising of the show’s central mystery, “There is going to be a satisfying whodunnit at the end.”

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Billy seems very dead. But Dan Fogelman is known for his twists and Paradise isn’t how it seems. Can you confirm this is the last we see of Billy?

I can’t confirm or deny. Billy makes an appearance in the next episode in some key flashback moments. So right away, you’re wondering, as you always are with Dan Fogelman, have we seen the last of anybody? Since half of the drama unfolds in the past, even I don’t know. He doesn’t appear in episodes six or seven, and I won’t confirm or deny if you see him in [the finale]. But they are already hard at work on some really excellent scripts for season two. And I can’t say word one about if you’ll see Billy again, because Dan does everything through time. He’s the master of it. You watched the president die in episode one, and then Marsden [who continues to appear in flashback scenes], in a lot of peoples’ views, is still one of the best parts of the show.

So it sounds like you are keeping the door open about season two (which has yet to be officially renewed). Dan Fogelman told me he has a three-season plan for Paradise. When the show was pitched to you, were you clued in on season one only or more?

I only knew about season one once I started working. But, going back in time as I was auditioning for this thing, I didn’t even know that much. Every time there was another round of auditions, I would be handed more material and more insight as to just what’s going on here. Then ultimately, when I get he job, I was then handed new scripts week by week and not only would I learn more about Billy, but I would learn more about everyone I’m talking to. It made you wonder if what they said in the last episode was genuine. So we were on the ride just like audiences are for a lot of the season.

Billy dies at the end of this fourth episode, but first he gets a backstory and is central to the hour. When you got the script, did you get to talk it through or ask questions of Dan?

Yes, I did. Dan is amazing for a million reasons. Mike Medavoy trusted me to play a real-life war hero in a miniseries that we did together [The Long Road Home] and Kevin Costner recently gave me a beautiful role in his Horizon series. With those possible competitors, Billy is the juiciest, most rich and three-dimensional role I’ve ever been offered. In addition to Dan being brilliant enough to write it, he also throughout the audition process, was giving me encouragement. Because when something is this good on the page, I’m throwing my hat into a ring with some really fancy hats already in it. I was given pats on the back from Dan specifically that he liked what I was doing and that he saw something in me. This is the guy who brings you a fully fledged person, and then still wants you to embellish and bring yourself to it, and I think that’s what makes him great. He’s a brainy guy, but he comes from all heart and impulse.

I’m just really lucky that one of those impulses was me, because he really fought for me and pushed back some more notable, shinier faces. I’m really grateful he did. So it was collaborative, but he also had a clear vision from the get-go.

Could you share any of those shiny faces who also went out for Billy?

I wont reveal any of those people! But they are actors I admire. Your career is made in this town in moments when people take a chance on you. Dan Fogelman took a big chance on me, and I just hope that I made him proud.

Actors often talk about what a gift it is to get a backstory, like Billy was given here. There are many questions around Billy. We understand Sinatra (Julianne Nicholson) doesn’t give him much of a choice, but he does still have to live with his choices. So, who is the real Billy? Is he the fun uncle to Xavier’s kids, or the cold-blooded killer? Is he working an angle all the time? Why was his guard so down on Jane? Overall, what did this episode tell you about how to play Billy?

I love that question. I think what’s brilliant about the writing is that, while we’re in a murder mystery with a twist and turn every two minutes to keep audiences on the edge of their seats, Dan lives in character. These characters are three-dimensional people with wants and hopes and aspirations and fears and secrets and shames. Billy, we find out, lands in Paradise, this underground bunker, where everyone else is facing their worst nightmare. For him, it’s a little bit of a second chance. It’s almost a dream scenario and he can start over. It’s the closest to normalcy he’s ever had. So when he’s hiding things, even from his best friend Xavier, he’s doing it out of hope of preserving this chance to be OK.

I think what Dan did that’s really special is that he asks through Billy, are we more than just the sum of the worst things we’ve ever done? Is there a chance for someone with sins to atone for them and to do something truly good; to be a good uncle, a good friend, even a good lover, and a good partner? Is there such a thing as a second chance?

I was thrilled to fill in those blanks you’re asking about with parts of myself and things that I wrestle with all the time. I’m very newly an uncle in my real life and it makes you see the world differently. You want the world suddenly to be a different place for someone you love. That makes you look backwards and forward. It’s really great writing when you feel that’s true with a character — and there’s a murder mystery with a twist every 10 minutes.

Billy knows more than anyone about what’s really outside of Paradise, which is the show’s looming question. We saw that Billy could breathe the air and his victim said she found survivors. How was that scene described in the script about what Billy found?

There was a version earlier where a key player, a survivor, was with the scientists, indicating that there are still possibly communities on Earth’s surface. There’s this indication that what we’re being told by Sinatra and by these people trying to keep some semblance of order together down below is not even close to the whole picture. I certainly as a fan want to see season two explore the surface of the Earth and what’s left of civilization. These things are exciting on a sci-fi, alarmingly not-too-distant-in-the-future level, but they’re also rich with the colors that Dan likes to paint with. What do humans do in extraordinary circumstances? It was a terrifying scene to talk about and to do, because it gets to the heart of what’s next in the show, but it also gets to the heart of Billy and the questions we’re all asking and the secrets we’re all keeping. It’s good stuff.

The potential of survivors reminds me of The Walking Dead, and the communities that popped up in that franchise. But in the Walking Dead, it’s after a zombie apocalypse. This Paradise climate apocalypse feels uncomfortably closer to reality. Dan also told me that he sat for three weeks with experts and his writers to research this show and make it truthful. Do you know about the research that went into crafting this story?

Somewhat. I don’t know exactly who they met with. I think some people asked to be kept anonymous — and they did extensive research — but Dan shared scary things. Like asking offhandedly of these experts, “Hey, if you are right, where should I move my family?” and they had specific answers. Right now it’s all speculation somewhat, but one aspect of what makes this show the right-now show is that it’s asking questions we’re all trying not to ask in the back of our heads. It’s asking about power and who gets to make big decisions when other peoples’ lives are at stake, and who gets to be safe if all of our safety gets pulled into question.

It used to be that if you set a show in a dystopian apocalypse, you’d set it at least 20 or 30 years in the future. I don’t know how specific Dan is in episode one with dates, but we’re talking about less than 10 years from now. It should feel like, “No way!” And I think it’s alarming for audiences because it’s a little harder to say that right now.

You are based in L.A. The recent wildfires also bring this plot even closer to home, as it tackles evacuating, leaving everything behind and survivor’s guilt. Have you gotten a sense of the L.A. reception?

A really brilliant actor who I got to work with during the shooting scene, Krys Marshall [who plays top Agent Robinson, the president’s lover], was evacuated from her home in Topanga, and she watched by the minute from her ring camera the fires getting closer. Luckily, her home is still standing. But some of he neighbors are not so lucky. Her performance in this is extremely powerful, but also her humanity and the way that she brought everyone back together in wake of that and focused on sort of redoubling on our efforts to tell this story, not as a political story, just as a human wake-up call. If we’re not all in the same boat on this one, then I think, frankly, we’re just delusional. Because, there’s only one boat! It’s been palpably real for the last few weeks as we’ve started sharing this show. We’re going to start feeling Mother Earth talking back, in louder and more obvious ways, and, god help us if that doesn’t unify us in some way, I don’t know what will.

Let’s talk about that mysterious number Xavier found written on the president’s cigarette. It was heavily hinted to the audience that it’s a plane serial number. Do you know the answer?

I do know what that number is, and you guys all will soon.

What should we make of the significance of that number?

What I’ll say is that all the fan theories I’ve read and heard so far are extremely sharp. They are as good, if not better, than the theories I had when I first read through the season. Everything you’re looking at is significant. But if you think you know who did it, I’m willing to bet you $100 you’re not quite right.

Is Sinatra a total villain at this point, or is there hope for her still?

I’m so lucky to be a part of this cast, most notably the leadership and talent of Sterling K. Brown. That is a huge part of why I think this show is resonating. That guy is a better human than he is actor, and he might be one of the best actors that we’ve got, so that’s saying a lot. The way that trickles down, as he’s star and also executive producer, is that you get actors like James Marsden and Julianne Nicholson to come and not just to be a part of this but to bring something that is next level, especially in the case of Julianne. Dan trusts us to make that question of who is the good guy and who is the bad guy an impossible one to answer. If you’ve seen what Nicholson is doing, while there are things she does as Sinatra that I think are reprehensible, maybe even bordering on unforgivable, the humanity that she brings to this role I think makes that question impossible to answer.

I think the harder questions for us, maybe as people, is when there are no clear-cut answers on that. There is going to be a satisfying whodunnit at the end of this, but we’re all going to be left in the gray as to who is good and who is bad.

Is that answer coming by the end of the season?

You betcha. Hang onto the edge of your seat, it’s really good.

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The first four episodes of Paradise are streaming on Hulu, with new episodes dropping weekly on Tuesdays. Read THR‘s episode four postmortem with creator Dan Fogelman.